How's that hope and change working out for you?
how can this be?? i thought the stimulus was going to save us all. man am i disappointed. (gag)
YES WE CAN!
What is so bad about being unemployed? Free healthcare, free food, free cellphones, Øbamamoney for all!
MMMM MMMMM MMMMM
I am so glad that the One has brought us back from the brink, the new phrase is jobless recovery
Well, I'm convinced. Let's put the govenment in charge of health care, too.
We obviously need to expand government jobs and nationalize more of our industries.
Bad news for Pelosi and company.
Marlin, how is that bad news? They'll just say "WE WON!!!"....
the electorate, however, is readying the torches and pitchforks for 2010, I think that's as good a news as we can expect right now....
You evil folks are partly to blame defeating gay marriage cost the state of Maine jobs . (THEY DID SAY IT WOULD HELP )
It would have been a huge boost bringing in more out of staters .
On the bright side , now that Maine passed question 5 I can see the green jobs will finally come .
U-6 is now 17.5%, Depression 2.0 is just around the corner. More people are just giving up.
How is Barry going to blame that on Bush?
Remember the Promise of the Stimulus?
the GOP slogan for 2010 and 2012... "How's that hope and change been workin' for ya"
Hope and change, still believe in it...at least the Democrats have been working hard to keep
things together, coming up with ideas and working on the issues. The only thing I can see that the Right has done is to say NO to everything, how about putting some real ideas out there for debate for a change, ideas that are solid and with substance.
Remember, this recession began back in 2007..I've not seen one economist since this all began who thought we would be out of this mess quickly. Will there be more pain to come...most likely.
This economy doesn't give a hoot what your ideologies are, it will strike a Liberal just as hard as a Conservative ...Good luck to all of you..be kind to others..a failing economy doesn't care who you are or what you believe in.
Still haven't taken that Econ 101 course I suggested months ago, eh?
Hope and change, still believe in it...
Will there be more pain to come...most likely.
You might save these quotes for later use. They'll be current next year, too, as long as the administration keeps coming up with ideas and working on the issues.
Well JohnD have you been paying attention, Republicans have been shut out. You are not allowed to dissent, Hummana and Chamber of Commerce have found this out. Maybe you can tell us how we are going to pay for all these great ideas. Has the govt ever created a job with their own earned money, they can't unless they take your money to do it.
Wasnt Barry elected to be the economy President ? (mccain didnt know the slighest )
No, I have not taken a recent course in Economics...but I have been reading a great deal, and it's pretty clear that the debate between economist themselves in the end proves little or has come up with "The" answer, their opinions are as wide and diverse as is that of the Left and the Right, Sir.
I would wager that a great many reading this blog have not spent time in the class room or in self study of economics either, but, does that mean that our thinking is inferior to someone such as yourself.
In this age of information, and disinformation for that matter, to get a since of something does not require a PHD, as you well know,
there are countless "certified" economist out there who also apparently haven't a clue either, surely you don't subscribe to all economic theory? Theory is great, but from my humble observations, no economic theory seems to be able to hold the test of time. Just because one system appears to prove itself in predictions for a time, they all in the end fail the ultimate test of endurance...
Suppose Sir, for the sake of this short game, that you actually have "The Answer", that answer that will save the day for all....where and how do you explain this answer to those of us who apparently are unable to fathom your amazing concept..you know you have to explain it to us, because no matter how good, or how perfect your idea is...we, the people have the one thing that you need, we have the one thing that will allow your idea to come to life..to make it real...We have the Vote. And you need that Vote, because without it, your idea is dead. It has no substance, no life, no reality, it is just a thought in your head.
You have to share with us, in detail your idea..and then you have to prove or at least convince us that your idea will do the trick...
but you are competing with many other voices out there...many other ideas...if all you can do is shout out some emotional diatribe, then your idea is worthless. You have "NO" idea and "NO" is the only thing that comes out of your mouth, and "NO" is not the ideas we need to correct the mess we are in, is it Sir?
I still have hope, and things certainly have already changed, and will continue to change. We are in a mess..Say Brother...can you spare a dime!
Well the Keynesian economists don't have a clue that is for sure, and that includes just about every talking head economist out there.
Obama is no more to blame than Bush, both, and those preceding them thought that you could produce wealth and jobs by creating debt. They did, but it goes only so far and we have reached the limit. You actually have to produce a product of worth, rather than just throw money around on war and sundries.
Greenspan and the fed along with the other world banks created this mess and they have no way out, but to create more debt and another bubble of false fiat economy.
We all, worldwide have to take the pain of paying back the debt, creating more debt just delays the pain and makes it worse in the end.
You should listen to some Austrian economists, the Mises.com site is a good place to start, lewrockwell.com another. Ron Paul and some 200 plus house members are trying to audit the fed and try and get money matters under control, last I heard the money printers are trying to gut the bill.
Brennake and the Treasury are in this bank bailout/stimulus money scam up to their eyeballs, they are grasping at straws.
I don't blame Obama other than the fact that he is clueless and a cheap politician, just like 75 % of those in every state house and DC.
"You have had your fun boys now pay for it"
Johnd, First we have to figure out what the mess is, what caused it and then solve it. Since the folks in congress caused this mess I highly doubt they know how to fix it. Can you tell us what business experience the President has? How about Bernanke, Geitner, Pelosi, Reid, Biden, Snowe, Collins, Michaud take your pick. There have been ideas put forth by the republicans such as tort reform, allowing us to buy insurance across state lines etc. Has the President ever created a job in his life?
That was a great post, seriously. You seem to be developing some real style.
Like you, I can't claim any authority in economics. I'm just a practical plodder who has read a book or two.
I would suggest that you exaggerate the differences among economists. Economists agree far more often than they disagree, but agreement doesn't make the news as often. I understand that an emphasis on the reported perplexities of economics might discourage one from further study.
I'm confident that Obama's economic advisers could carry on a civil conversation with other economists considered to be "conservatives" and would be in general agreement about many, certainly not all, of the issues currently in the news.
I agree with Mike G. that the Austrian school of economics is a school of economics that's worth studying (even if Mike G.'s air of ideological certainty might scare one off). On the other hand, one would need to study economics in intensive detail before one knew enough about the subject to claim adherence to one school or another.
But basic economics knows no school, nor are schools of economics sharply delineated. Basic - i.e. Adam Smith's classical - economics has withstood the test of time. A knowledge of economics enables one to make sense of many things - not all things, certainly - that are impenetrable to those who can't think in economic terms. Don't give up just because it seems confusing.
The administration promised ca. under 8% with the stimulus, threatened ca. over 9% without it and now we have 10.2%. The layman without training in a subject must rely on the reliability of the specialist's predictions. This test is always available whether it concerns economic policy or climate change projections.
If one takes cognizance of the lack of consensus among economists, how is it possible to put any faith in government economic policies and planning? That would require commitment to one school of economic thought and rejection of all others. Anything else would be chaotic.
It is an invariable rule of busy-body politics that if an issue is agitating the public you must be seen to be DOING SOMETHING. If you can't think of anything useful you do something useless and if you can't do something useless, do something damaging. The thing is you have to do something.
There is no certainty when it comes to economics. :) but as you said, it might be time to look at another side vs the common dogma
Did anyone else get the impression that Johnd might be channeling Mr. Olbermann in his latest post? (at least in paragraphs 4 & 5)
Prof Frary exactly, can you imagine if a politician came out and said " we are going to have to cut welfare, warring, environmental laws, the whole list of wants of a overburdened society for 5 years, and then maybe we can crawl our way out of this stupidity
If one takes cognizance of the lack of consensus among economists, how is it possible to put any faith in government economic policies and planning?
Perhaps this comment about the proper role of economists is relevant here -
"Buchanan argues that the are two important points to stress. First, the most important social role of the economist is to be a teacher of the principles of the spontaneous order of the market economy. We must be teachers, not social engineers. Second, we must resist the maximization paradigm and instead emphasize the spontaneous coordination the market economy achieves. We study exchange, not allocation and optimization subject to constraints."
The wisdom of Buchanan
Economists should teach the public to run the government, and not run the government themselves.
quote from John: "if all you can do is shout out some emotional diatribe, then your idea is worthless."
You summarized your last few posts quite well....
Liberals are now in charge, making the decisions and running this economy into the ground as efficiently as FDR did. The Answer is for the government to stop federalizing banks, the auto industry, medicine, stop the "stimilus" nonsense and let the market forces do the correction they so badly need to make on their own.
Many large organizations are just beginning their planned layoffs and plant closings from decisions made last winter. This is just the start of a positive feedback mechanism.
It is unlikely that 10.2% will be the peak, especially if the ruling class get their way with global warming and climate change nonsense.
The most telling statistic for me is the 589K drop in the household survey. That survey generally captures the self employed and employees of very small companies. That the self employed are faring this badly paints an even bleaker picture of the economy than the 10.2 percent unemployment rate does.
I think it validates the complaint that Obama's policies have been aimed at big business instead of focusing on the real job creation engine of small business.
great point, the underemployed is hard to predict and is ignored and is seldomed mentioned by the media and government. In reality the impact will be great for lost tax revenue from both fed local and state. This is one reason the state and feds projections will always be in shortfall and why the debt will always increase over projected.
There are hard choices to be made and the politicians are unwilling to make them.
Yes can you imagine the harm that will be done by levying a tax on fuel consumption on everyone in the US, not to mention the inefficiency of having government bureaucracy in doling out the so called benefits of same.
Government making jobs, by increasing bureaucratic jobs who produce nothing, but paperwork and increased costs to business and consumers.
There, we have a few issues to consider beyond shouting NO to Obama and the idiots in DC and Augusta.