I know that, you know that, but try convincing anyone who pays taxes in the middle 3 figures that there is a problem.Still, we soldier on and wait for the opportunity that a disaster will deliver.
You mean you can't repeal the laws of economics? Or the laws of physics?Come on guys, you're bursting my bubble. What if those laws aren't morally acceptable? What it they don't feel right?Let's ask LL, our resident barrister. Is there a legal process for modifying the laws of economics? Does it take a referendum, or must we revise the Reality Constitution?
Melvin, I believe it would be very possible to cut down on how much you give the state in tax dollars. I believe it would be a simple matter of economizing. It might be a little inconvenent for a while but worth it in the end. If I may make a few suggestions.
If you have more than one car in the family can you get by with one? That is one registration and one excise tax Plus maybe gas taxes. 22 cents a gallon.
Were you plannning on a new car or ATV? If you can put it off for a while, look at the excise tax and sales taxes they will not get
If you are going down the toll road, can you leave a half hour earlier and keep that toll in your pocket?
If you hunt and fish, would it be worth it in the long run to skip a year and keep that forty dollars in your pocket.
If you planned your buying so as to avoid sales taxes that would be less money for the state.
There are a multitude of ways you can keep money out of the hands of the state if you WANT to. May it be a little inconvenient for a while? yes. Will it save you money? Yes Can you buy these things later? yes. It is a matter of how bad you want to stop sending your money to the state.
Think about. It has worked for me, but we need thousands more. It is all legal and we can all do it in our own way and in our own time.
Bud[ 04-04-2003: Message edited by: budlandry@mid ]
Shopping in New Hampshire is another way to avoid maine theft. try the internet.I need a new car (mine is 10 years old) but I will try to push that off a year for the cause. ;)
James, If you are willing to try to put off your new car for a year to give this a try I take my hat off to you, but we need many more to help. We need to talk this up. It is going to take a lot of people. Do you have any ideas in this department? My wife and I live eight miles from a grocery store and twenty miles from the next shopping center. She used to go to one or the other about every day. She has cut down to not more than twice a week and is working to cut down to less. It has surprised us how much this has saved just in gas tax money.
Bud[ 04-04-2003: Message edited by: budlandry@mid ]
another way to keep solvent is to do your essential shopping at the closest grocery store. As food is one of the very few items our legislature has not taxed, the only down side is the potentially higher shelf prices that might be at your local store, but I would rather give it to the company than to the state.Still, few if any will do this. What will have an effect is the steadilly deteriorating economy here. As more and more people make less and less or flee in frustration to other less greedy places, this will have a BIG impact on financing their folly.Of course, when push comes to shove, the legislature will simply increase taxes (maybe disguised as "reform") sooner than cut spending. They do not understand "cuts". Try this...use the word with the legislature and see the glazed look appear. Actually, what I have done and will do is support ANY tax cap inniative. That will force the legislature to stop spending and will scare those in the legislature who only serve because of the largess they deliver to their constituents.
James, I wish you the best of luck on a tax cap but it will not happen as long as the takers out number the givers and every time we lose workers such as the 300 in Orono the workers lose numbers.
If there is not a tax revolt, then there will only be the slow Maine death spiral to look forward to. The politicians will simply not reverse course without being forced.Predictions of the future...Summer, 2010, dateline Augusta. After yet another heated debate, the legislature today reluctantly passed tax reform legislation, the 4th reform in the last 5 years. This years reform extends the 8% sales tax to all items purchased anywhere at any time and imposes a penalty on those who try to avoid their civic responsibilities by not buying enough to ensure the benevolent state the resources to provide for those less fortunate. In a related move, the Governors blue ribbon committee studying the alledged decline in Maines business climate all traveled to Presque isle to personally examine the workings of the last privately owned business employing more than 30 employees in the state. When asked, Bud GodWhatHitUs, remarked that a small bit less regulation might aid in improving his business climate. He added that he did not understand the need for one on site bureaucrat per private employee, especially when the bureaucrat was being paid far more than his employees. Sidney GimmeAllYourMoney from the taxation committee responded with the obvious "If we did not supervise your every move you might be tempted to move your business across state lines in the middle of the night and then where would the state be?" On the long drive back to Augusta through the darkened ghost towns of northern maine, Rep GimmeAllYourMoney advised the accompanying press that it's the attitude of those greedy business owners that has put Maine in the sad state it is in today, what with the entire middle class not employed by the government, having left the state. After a quick stop in the "we once sold food" tofu chain, we made a side trip to the nearest free health clinic, all paid for by those administrative savings found under single payer and the unfortunate 200% tax increase that went with it, to pump several stomaches. The entire commitee arived back in Augusta just in time to avoid the mandatory blackout necessitated by the closing of yet another utility taken over by the state when "privatization" failed 2 years ago after the state courageously insisted the previous greedy owners sell electricity under cost to anyone who demanded it. :D
And you say your attitude is not defeatist?
Bud[ 04-05-2003: Message edited by: budlandry@mid ]
Bud...let's not confuse realism with defeatism.
Is there s aingle prediction there that is not already on the map for legislative action?All that restrains them is lethargy. :eek:
Here's a quick view of Richardson/Dudley bill "An Act to Modernize Maine's Tax System." How come "modernizing" always means "raising?"But hey....its only $120 per year or so for every man, woman, child, or other in the state.
State of Maine Legislature
Summary of LD 1394Bill Info
LD 1394 (HP 1020)
"An Act To Modernize the State's Tax System"
Sponsored by Representative Benjamin Dudley et al $(117,000,000) Targeted Tax Relief: Increases Tax for Homeowners over $125,000 Value;
$15,000,000 Higher Lodging Tax Tourist Industry;
$30,000,000 Business Equipment; Cuts by 30% or eliminates;
$(40,000,000) Income tax relief= exemptions to federal level; refundable Earned Income Tax Credit;
$40,000,000 New Tax bracket 10% for over $100,000;
$225,000,000 Eliminates Sales Tax exemptions =Higher Sales Taxes paid by everyone; $153,000,000 Total Raised Oh yeah....there were "no new taxes in the budget"; that's because they're in a different bill! Recall time.You can't generate citizen initiatives fast enough to keep up with these spending pukes. And Richardson is building voter support for his Blaine House run.
Hey Threeputt, how about checking with Augusta to see how many of the "loyal opposition" party will be voting for this one, on top of their support for the budget.m.
Oh yeah....all the usual suspects are supporting this bill.It appears to be heavily supported by a number of very active organizations; consumers for affordable Health Care, Dirigo Alliance, Maine AFL-CIO, Maine Assoc. of Interdependent Neighborhoods, Me Citizens Leadership Fund, Maine Council of Churches, Maine Council of Sr. Citizens, Alliance for Retired Americans, Maine Center for Economic Policy, Maine Labor Group on Health, Maine People's Alliance, Maine Women's Lobby, NAMI Maine National Association of Social Workers, Maine and Roman Catholic Diocese of Maine.
Here's how the Maine Council of Churches feels about taxes.MAINE COUNCIL of CHURCHESPRINCIPLES FOR FAIR TAXATION
The collection and distribution of taxes are the obvious means by which a society supports a mutually shared responsibility for the education, safety, health and general well-being of all citizens. The way we collect and distribute taxes represents society’s loftiest values of compassion and mutuality and thus tax policy is essentially a moral issue. At this crucial time, our Maine legislators are challenged by the present scarcity of customary resources during a period of increasing needs. Legislators are thus faced with the difficult choice of raising taxes or cutting essential services. Although we share a concern about how much of our private wealth needs to be given to the common wealth, we would support additional taxes if they were necessary to meet the essential needs of the poor.As we struggle through this budget crisis, we offer three guiding principles based upon our religious convictions and traditions:• That all tax increases and tax cuts in benefits be apportioned fairly between Maine households and Maine businesses. We are particularly concerned that those with political power not sway decisions for their benefit at the expense of the poor who are often voiceless in the political arena.
• That special consideration is given to the needs of those most dependent on government support for their health and safety.
• That tax policies be progressive, intentionally designed to collect more from those more able to pay.A morally-based value system supports the principle that those with more wealth share compassionately and proportionately with those who have less. In such a society, integrity is judged by how fairly the “membership dues” (taxes) of a caring community are collected proportionately and then how fairly they are distributed to meet the demonstrated needs of its citizens. We emphasize that the distribution of our common wealth must include a special responsibility for those who are most vulnerable – children, elders, the sick, the poor, prisoners, and the homeless – if we are to be considered just in our social obligations.Tax policy has tremendous potential to divide communities. The debate about taxes, of course, centers around how much money we get to keep for ourselves and how much we are expected to contribute to the common wealth of the community. We also have a moral obligation to assure that the money from the shared pool is spent efficiently and for the common good, not for the privileged few. We have confidence in the democratic legislative process in Maine to manage our tax policy in a morally responsible manner. We support the democratic process with the expectation that its deliberations will serve the common good with a special commitment to aiding and protecting the most vulnerable.
When taxes are fairly determined and regulated, they create a stable and compassionate society, one that assures the health and safety of all citizens, especially for the most vulnerable.
I would be so much more impressed if the Council of Churches was not a tax exempt organization representing tax exempt organizations! ;)
I am in possession of the State's "Compendium of State Fiscal Information", covering through FY ending June 30, 2002.You can get a copy by contacting the Office of Fiscal and Program Review in the State Leg. Go to the web to find email addresses.It provides all sorts of interesting summary level info, including revenues, expenditures, etc. One little tidbit: "Grants, Subsidies, and Pensions""To Public and Private Orgs": $300M in FY98, to $412M in FY 02, up 37% in four years."To Individuals": $510M in FY98, to $834M in FY02, for a 64% increase in four years.Anyone want to guess how long we can sustain these kinds of increases before going absolutely broke?PS: "Personal Services" up 31% in the same four years. Total expenditures up by 36% in four years. They say we're becoming a "services" economy? I'd say we're becoming a "government" economy. Name another sector that's grown at this level in the last four years.