Smart meters, yet another intrusion?

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Robert
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Joined: 04/01/2005 - 1:01am
Conservation is a load of

Conservation is a load of crap!

People use less electricity, means less revenue for the power company, they just increase rates.
People use less water and sewer, means less revenue for the water company, they just increase rates.

So on and on.

Conservation is a load of crap!

Dan Billings
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Joined: 10/02/2005 - 12:01am
The comparison to sewer and

The comparison to sewer and water is off-base. For both sewer and water, the costs are primarily fixed costs and the incremental cost of producing more water or handiling more sewer is small as long as the utility is within capacity of its plants.

With electricity, actually producing the power is a large portion of the bill and, in Maine, the companies that distribute the power no longer produce it.

Naran
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Joined: 10/06/2004 - 12:01am
What you say may be correct

What you say may be correct for most Maine electric companies, Dan. However, our own electric bills have increased a great deal in recent years, and the reason cited by our electric company (locally owned) is the reduction of large users. We've lost some significant, large manufacturers and companies.

Melvin Udall
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Joined: 05/01/2002 - 12:01am
The water company here raised

The water company here raised it's rates because people aren't using as much; lower flush toilets, less baby clothes to wash, etc.

It's pretty much you can't win.

The notion of remotely controlling the flow of absolutely critical energy into your house, and what mischief that opens us up to on the part of government, the utility companies, and the hackers is the most worrisome piece of news in some time.

The environmental lobby has to be seeing this as a victory of massive proportions.

Dan Billings
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Joined: 10/02/2005 - 12:01am
Naran: Yes, the situation is

Naran: Yes, the situation is different in Kennebunk and Madison where the distribution of electricty has been socialized. The answer is to outlaw government run electric utilities. Say No to Socialism!

Naran
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Joined: 10/06/2004 - 12:01am
Okay - I know the old saying

Okay - I know the old saying is "Power to the People." However in this case, the idea of Kennebunk Light & Power being a socialist organization is hilarious. The director, Sharon Staz, is one of the most fiscally conservative people you'd ever meet.
:)

Dan Billings
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Joined: 10/02/2005 - 12:01am
By definition, government

By definition, government ownership of industry is socialism.

Naran
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Joined: 10/06/2004 - 12:01am
So, we should disband all the

So, we should disband all the airports and the sewer, water, electricity.and power plants in our nation? (Who's up for managing a nuclear power plant, come on down!)

Better Socialist than Silly.

Dan Billings
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Joined: 10/02/2005 - 12:01am
What nuclear power plants are

What nuclear power plants are run by the government?

Most electric utilities are companies, not government owned.

Naran
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Joined: 10/06/2004 - 12:01am
The Associated Press Maine

The Associated Press
Maine town asks for delay in meter installation

October 22, 2010

SCARBOROUGH, Maine—A southern Maine town is asking Central Maine Power Co. to delay installing its so-called "smart meters," to give residents more time to learn about them.

The Scarborough Town Council's resolution asks CMP to hold off for at least 90 days and to hold a public forum so residents can assess if the meters pose any risks.

[url=http://www.boston.com/news/local/maine/articles/2010/10/22/maine_town_as...

Naran
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Joined: 10/06/2004 - 12:01am
CMP: Opposition to new meters

CMP: Opposition to new meters 'clearly unreasonable'
By Emily Parkhurst
E-mail and share
Nov 09, 2010 10:20 am

AUGUSTA — Central Maine Power Co. has asked the Maine Public Utilities Commission to dismiss one of two complaints filed in October by residents concerned about the safety of "smart" electric meters being installed on every CMP customer's home or business.

[url=http://www.theforecaster.net/content/pnms-smartmeters-111010]Source[/url]

************

Side note on the Smart Meter discussion.... will California's executive snooping be repeated here?

************

Senior PG&E director admits snooping on SmartMeter critics

By Dana Hull

dhull@mercurynews.com
Updated: 11/11/2010 09:34:12 AM PST

A PG&E executive who oversees the utility's SmartMeter program has admitted using a false name to try to join an online group opposed to the meters and secretly monitoring other online forums critical of PG&E.

The disclosure by William Devereaux, senior director of PG&E's SmartMeter program, is likely to be yet another public relations disaster for the utility, which is eager to overcome widespread resistance to its SmartMeter program ...

[url=http://www.mercurynews.com/business/ci_16558858?nclick_check=1]Oops... another one finds out there's no such thing as online anonymity.[/url]

Naran
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Joined: 10/06/2004 - 12:01am
Cape Elizabeth joins towns

Cape Elizabeth joins towns urging CMP to delay 'smart' meters

By Amy Anderson

CAPE ELIZABETH — The Town Council on Monday unanimously passed a resolution urging Central Maine Power Co. to delay installation of "smart" electric meters or related wireless equipment for at least 90 days.

[url=http://www.theforecaster.net/content/pnms-smartmeters-111010]Source[/url]

Naran
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Joined: 10/06/2004 - 12:01am
According to the CMP delay

According to the CMP delay protest article, the main concern regarding the Smart Meters is old wiring in many Maine homes, along with health concerns due to the transmitters used by the new meters. There also appears to be a concern that the meter installers may not be properly trained and licensed.

editor@maineccs.org
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Joined: 11/21/2010 - 4:09pm
Distraction is an art that is

Distraction is an art that is best practiced by the Federal government.

When it comes to Smart Meters, everyone seems to be focused on the physical effects of the meters. I doubt that is where the real danger comes from.

Let's start at the source of the push for Smart Meters - GE's multi-billion stimulus funding just for Smart Metering. Then lets consider GE's warm and fuzzy with those who would love to know what you and I say, think and do. Then lets put a device on the outside of your home that can monitor not only your energy usage but your wireless Internet, cell phone and other communications. And of course we need to give that device two-way communication capabilities so the programming can be updated. I can't imagine how much data storage a Smart Meter should need, but I bet it can be upgraded to more than enough.

If the power grid would simply give everyone the access codes, we could all take part in that massive multi-player online gaming. Or at least we could cut out the ever rising costs of Time Warner.

"One key element of the new Smart Grid is the installation of a completely new two-way communication network between the energy suppliers and their customers. This communication network will be constructed to enable new energy concepts such as real-time pricing, load shedding, consumption management, cost savings from peak load reduction, cost savings from energy efficiency, integration of plug-in hybrid electric vehicles for grid energy storage, and the integration of distributed generation such as photovoltaic systems and wind turbines. This new network will be constructed using various communication paths including fiber optic cable, hybrid fiber coax, twisted pair, broadband over power line, and wireless technology. These types of communication networks are all currently operating in the nation’s electric grid, but are not yet implemented to the extent that will be required for enabling the Smart Grid." - U.S. Department of Energy Office of Electricity Delivery and Energy Reliability April 2009 - Study of Security Attributes of Smart Grid Systems – Current Cyber Security Issues

I doubt the Feds would irradiate the people they wish to eavesdrop on. Smart Meters = Cableless Modems

Islander
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Joined: 02/13/2009 - 12:16pm
This is just another way for

This is just another way for the govt to collect information from us. Medical records online,smart meters,etc all give the govt the ability to track us.
What is next a national id?

pmrmsm
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Joined: 05/08/2006 - 10:52am
For the millions of Americans

For the millions of Americans who have them, it is called a passport.

workingclassschlep
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Joined: 01/20/2008 - 12:43pm
editor@maineccs.org, I too,

editor@maineccs.org, I too, have been trying to figure out why most of the the Maine media has been reporting almost exclusively on the radiation issue/complaint.

Naran, thanks for posting The Forecaster article that sheds some light on the other complaint dealing with old wiring/lack of contractor licenses.

Islander
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Joined: 02/13/2009 - 12:16pm
Sorry I didn't realize

Sorry I didn't realize passports are mandatory or can be tracked with a RFID chip.

Punk
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Joined: 03/12/2005 - 1:01am
I work on the

I work on the software/database side of "Smart Meter" projects.

Let me say that folks are giving this technology WAY too much credit for 'personal intrusion'.

If some are worried about technology allowing the gov't or corporations to track your behavior, maybe you'll reconsider your behavior with Internet surfing and telephone/cell communications.

Perhaps you'll change your voting patterns and not support some of the things that open gov't intrusion floodgates like "The Patriot Act".

I mean really-- why major in the minors?

matt8888
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Joined: 10/14/2007 - 10:09am
Let me say that folks are

Let me say that folks are giving this technology WAY too much credit for 'personal intrusion'.

I agree. They already hire people to read the meters each month, now they read the meters using wireless. Whats the difference if its read by computer or human?

That said........ it would be nice to know more about the technology, wattage, etc. I don't want to hear its similar to a cell phone if its not using cell phone technology. I'd like to know more about the tech specs.

workingclassschlep
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Joined: 01/20/2008 - 12:43pm
When I go online, I am

When I go online, I am entering cyberspace. Smart Meters reach inside my home without my permission.

Privacy and Hacking Risks: http://news.cnet.com/8301-27080_3-20007672-245.html

matt8888
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Joined: 10/14/2007 - 10:09am
When I go online, I am

When I go online, I am entering cyberspace. Smart Meters reach inside my home without my permission.

Wow, that article has allot of FUD (fear, uncertainty and doubt) The only real issue I see is if a hacker or teenager can turn off your power meter (digital vandalism) or if people can change their billing.

Seems to me, if we dont want more rolling blackouts, the power companies need a better way of monitoring power usage. That may be why the gov is offering incentives.

Islander
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Joined: 02/13/2009 - 12:16pm
Punk, are you saying that

Punk, are you saying that just by the threat of the govt watching/tracking we should modify our behaviour, sounds like terrorism, nudge nudge. This beats the re-education camps by a long shot, lol

Punk
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Joined: 03/12/2005 - 1:01am
Workingclassschlep-- If it

Workingclassschlep-- If it makes you feel better to think about it that way, that's OK.

workingclassschlep
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Joined: 01/20/2008 - 12:43pm
Punk, it makes me angry that

Punk, it makes me angry that they are invading my personal space. I do feel better stating what's true. Thanks.

Islander
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Joined: 02/13/2009 - 12:16pm
Punk, can they be modified in

Punk, can they be modified in the future to the point where they can turn power on and off (like onstar can), can they be hacked into? I would prefer to stay with the meter reader rather than reward GE with money to provide something that is not necessary.

workingclassschlep
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Joined: 01/20/2008 - 12:43pm
They can be turned off and on

They can be turned off and on remotely right now. It's right on CMP's webpage.

matt8888
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Joined: 10/14/2007 - 10:09am
Next: Wireless water meters

Next: Wireless water meters (no need to send someone to read your meter and bill you)

Public response: The government knows when I'm taking a shower!!!! The horror!!! LOL.

Robert
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Joined: 04/01/2005 - 1:01am
Punk, are you saying that

Punk, are you saying that just by the threat of the govt watching/tracking we should modify our behaviour,

Islander, from experience, I can say that with these meters, most people will modify their behavior. Once they are all installed, look out for the tiered rates.

Punk
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Joined: 03/12/2005 - 1:01am
Islander - There are devices

Islander -

There are devices (appliances, etc) that are 'smart enabled' that someday may be able to communicate with a 'smart meter'. There has to be some kind of designed communication protocol.

re: Hacking -- well, anything can be hacked.

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